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Discussion Starter #1
Just returned from a frustrating experience at the dealership where I'd bought my 2017 Versa Note SV (Canadian). They're currently having a special on snow tires / wheels so I decided to take advantage. I like being prepared for winter and snow before hand.

I requested to also purchase the sensors so that pressures would be monitored on the snow tires, but the manager of the parts area swore up and down that the Versa Note does not have TPMS. He even claimed to have gone and checked his software, and said it did not show TPMS on the Versa Note.

Is there any way I can determine the presence of lack there of? Would supplying the VIN to Nissan Canada let them validate the situation?

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Discussion Starter #2
I see I should be able to get an idea by the light check

From th manual

With all doors closed, apply the parking brake,
fasten the seat belts and place the ignition switch
in the ON position without starting the engine.
The following lights (if so equipped) will come on:
<images of different lights>
The following lights (if so equipped) will come on
briefly and then go off:
<images of different lights>
If any light does not come on or operate in a way
other than described, it may indicate a burnedout
bulb and/or a system malfunction. Have the
system checked. It is recommended that you visit
a NISSAN dealer for this service.


The second set of lights includes the Tire icon
 

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Discussion Starter #3

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Yeah in the USA they have federally required TPMS sensors in ALL new cars since 2007/2008, so they could not sell the versa here without them. Last I heard they are, while nice to have, not required by law for Canada and being a car built to be as cheap as possible anything they didn't HAVE to put in your car you probably didn't get. TPMS sensors are rather costly.

I only WISH we did not have them here, I was recently donated a nice set of ENKEI ES6 16 inch rims with the correct bolt pattern and I'd love to use them but now I have to spend $150-$300 in TPMS sensors for those rims to be able to use them OR I have to pay the tire shop to break down my OEM wheels/tires and swipe those sensors (but who knows if they even have the right angle and dimensions to fit). Bit pain in the butt!

And the OEM TPMS is nothing great to start with, an idiot light that doesn't indicate which tire or what the pressures are, if you really want TPMS there are aftermarket options that probably work better than OEM.

I would say you are better off without them, but I have to admit it was nice a few weeks ago when I picked up a nail and had a slow leak, the light came on before the tire was dangerously low and I was easily able to remove and plug the hole and the tire is happy as can be, not sure if I would have picked up on the low tire as fast on my own (I don't walk around the passenger side that often). That being said thats all you really need to do is walk around the whole car and just look.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
The thing I found weird though was that the ad from the dealer included (for an extra $300) TPMS sensors for the Versa!

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I only WISH we did not have them here, I was recently donated a nice set of ENKEI ES6 16 inch rims with the correct bolt pattern and I'd love to use them but now I have to spend $150-$300 in TPMS sensors for those rims to be able to use them OR I have to pay the tire shop to break down my OEM wheels/tires and swipe those sensors (but who knows if they even have the right angle and dimensions to fit).
Please correct me if I am wrong but what prevents you from slapping those wheels on your car and call it a day, just ignoring the warning light or taping it over with a black tape?
 

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SlickVersa said:
Please correct me if I am wrong but what prevents you from slapping those wheels on your car and call it a day, just ignoring the warning light or taping it over with a black tape?
I know some people do that but there are a few things that keep me from going that route:

1) You can't really easily put tape over that light, would have to remove and partially dissemble the cluster which is risky.

2) Even if you taped over the light or removed the bulb, the info screen would also be showing you a warning all the time and maybe prevent you from looking at the other readouts such as trip miles and current MPG average, etc.

2.1) Car may make warning dings every so often to try to draw your attention to the warning on the screen.

3) Although not personally tested on the versa yet, every car I have encountered with TPMS has some features that will be disabled if the TPMS system is not alive and well. For starters, cruise control, although that is not applicable to my particular car. Secondly a car with TPMS error will not allow you to turn traction control / stability assist off. Third, I suspect the steering wheel controls for radio would be disabled as they were during the time when I had the airbag light on.

These little things add up to be enough annoyance to make me want the TPMS system to be working as normal. I can't stand lights on the dash, warning messages flashing and dinging on the info display, I want to be able to turn off trac control rev to 4000 RPM and drop the clutch to roast the tires (or rock out of a slippery situation in the winter), I want all the misc. features of the car to work properly. I want the car to be free of error codes or caveats if I suddenly decide to sell or trade it so it retains its max value.

Thats just me, many others are fine with the setbacks but when I get a car brand new like I did with this one I try to keep everything as close to perfect as I can for as long as possible.
 

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I can't stand lights on the dash, warning messages flashing and dinging on the info display, ...
Did you think about a way to reversible disconnect/disable TPMS? I do not know about Versa, but for example Toyota Yaris has a jailbreak method of disabling TPMS (something like messing up with a stand alone printed circuit behind a glove box, and it can be restored back). It could be a nice challenging project for Versa.
 

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SlickVersa said:
Did you think about a way to reversible disconnect/disable TPMS? I do not know about Versa, but for example Toyota Yaris has a jailbreak method of disabling TPMS (something like messing up with a stand alone printed circuit behind a glove box, and it can be restored back). It could be a nice challenging project for Versa.
I agree, a good project indeed and one I may finally tackle now that I have these rims and am incentivized to look for a solution to the problem. Funny you should ask because last week I was on a road trip and when it was not my turn to drive I was reading on my phone, researching TPMS and what is known about the RF transmissions they make and what success various students and hackers have had spoofing them. I suspect the cheapest possible solution (not counting one's time invested) would be to develop a TPMS RF signal spoofer using a small microcontroller such as arduino or similar.

In the USA TPMS transmit non-encrypted transmissions on the 315 Mhz band, elsewhere I believe they use 433 Mhz. So my parts list would look something like this:
1 - An arduino compatible board - aprox $3.20
2 - A 315 Mhz Transmitter and Receiver kit - $5.22
3 - Some kind of 12v to 5v power supply/regulator - Aprox. $5 or scavenged
4 - Project Box - aprox $0.90 (3D printed)
5 - some odds and ends laying around (wire, relay, etc) - free

If I had all those things, the hard part could start: Making the code.

If me or someone could develop a sketch that used those components properly I think that you could eavesdrop on the 315Mhz band and collect the transmissions made by the four stock TPMS sensors. Then if you could get a handle on those, you could bolt on a set of rims without any TPMS and using a relay switched to the ignition you could have the arduino power on with the car and repeatedly re-transmit the signals collected earlier at the same intervals as the OEM sensors (usually about once per sensor per minute). The idea is as long as the car keeps receiving valid signals from what appear to be the correct sensors (they have IDs) then it will *think* everything is good and well and no light will be triggered. If you ever swap the OEM rims back on with the sensors then simply disable the spoofing device.

Thats my best idea so far. I'm pretty certain if you simply pull the TPMS receiver from the CANBUS the rest of the car will *know* that component is missing and give you all sorts of warning lights and errors.

The tricky part is receiving and understanding the 315Mhz signals. Just because you have the transceiver and a microcontroller doesn't mean you can simply eavesdrop on those transmissions and understand them. Thats why I was reading up on what others have discovered about TPMS so far, stuff about machester encoding and blah blah blah.

I'm convinced the idea is possible, I'm not certain if I am the guy smart enough to figure it out and put the puzzle together. I am a web software developer, I only tinker with microcontrollers a bit in my spare time. I'm no expert. I would like to give it a try but right now I'm too busy with work and other things, the current side project is building an idle-assist module for an old 1988 carburated car of mine, made a cool bit of kit that senses the engine RPM from the negative side of the ignition coil but still working on the code and how to best interface a servo with the throttle plate.





 

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On my honda even pulling the fuse did nothing to disable it. The big issue was no burn outs cause the ability to disable traction control was not an option.

See, the rental car companies were behind this so people who needed new tires did not rent a car like theres or had similar size wheels and tires swap them over. :grin
 

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Another issue with TPMS occurs with my Mustang. It has the Track Pack option with special wheels for the Brembo brakes. Apparently it was a hassle by Ford to provide an appropriate spare tire and wheel so my car comes with no spare and instead a can of Slime, similar to what is used on road/mountain bike tires. You inject it into the tire to plug the leak. The problem with this is it fouls up the TPMS sensor in the tire, so you have to remove the tire to clean it or replace it.

Thus for my Mustang, I plan to call AAA road service when I get a flat, and have the car towed to a tire place. I would take it to Goodyear (are they still around?) or Firestone and have them fix the flat the right way: remove the tire and apply a vulcanized patch to the inside of the tire, rather than use a rope plug and pick like the gas stations do. After all, the tires on this car are 255/40 ZR19 Pirellis made in Italy. They are MO spec tires originally meant for Mercedes, and cost $350 a piece. However this raises the issue of towing of the car. :frown The Mustang sits pretty low and if the towing is not done right, it can damage the car. The car needs at least a dolly or a flatbed trailer to be towed, not a tow truck.
 

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Another issue with TPMS occurs with my Mustang. It has the Track Pack option with special wheels for the Brembo brakes. Apparently it was a hassle by Ford to provide an appropriate spare tire and wheel so my car comes with no spare and instead a can of Slime, similar to what is used on road/mountain bike tires. You inject it into the tire to plug the leak. The problem with this is it fouls up the TPMS sensor in the tire, so you have to remove the tire to clean it or replace it.
Did you think about an option to buy a spare full size steel or a compact spare rim and mount a cheap tire so that if you have a flat you can slap it on and not to wait for AAA on the side of the road and not to spent one of your 4 times a year service calls?
 

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When I started driving cars with tpms sensors I went from carrying fix-a-flat to a plug kit and compressor. I did this on top of the cars spare tire and jack. I later removed the spare tire and jack to save weight and cargo room and just keep the compressor and plug kit.
 

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I later removed the spare tire and jack to save weight and cargo room and just keep the compressor and plug kit.
The last flat I had was so catastrophic that no plug would do it. Only the spare tire saved the day. And it was about 300 miles from home.
 

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In that case you are screwed either way as a temp spare that use to come with the car is made to drive at 50 mph for 50 miles.

Thats where getting a steel wheel and tire comes in handy.


Me, Im never that far from home.
 

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Remove the spare tire when worn out and replace it with a tire that is cheap but the correct OD to keep the car at the right height. I continue to use the same spare wheel. As long as you don't run it forever they last. And the replacement tire will run at higher speeds. Yes, they tell you to junk the steel wheel but measure the metal thickness as compared to the others, it's pretty much the same. They just want to sell more spares there.

I personally plug and was driven there many years ago with over 40 flats in one year. I have worked it out to an art and about 95% dependability when doing them and often without even removing the tire, or 3 minutes or so to fix.

I NEVER run with no compressor in any car I have.
 

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Remove the spare tire when worn out and replace it with a tire that is cheap but the correct OD to keep the car at the right height. I continue to use the same spare wheel. As long as you don't run it forever they last. And the replacement tire will run at higher speeds. Yes, they tell you to junk the steel wheel but measure the metal thickness as compared to the others, it's pretty much the same. They just want to sell more spares there.
So you re-use the spare rim and just replace the worn out OEM tire with another one, the same narrow but large in OD? If this works, it is a very good idea. Do you have to select the same tire width, like 125? What replacement tire would you use for T125/70D15? Also, would a tire shop be willing to mount and balance different tire on spare rim? Sorry for so many questions, but I never thought about that.
 

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Is the compact spare not as tall as the stock tires? I know they are skinnier but I assumed they would make them tall enough so the car is not tilted towards one corner. If you put a taller tire on the spare rim will it still fit in its spot in the trunk?

Those would be my questions.

I also have had great success with plugs. Every tire I have jammed a cheap plug kit into is still running today, including one on my Versa. The plug kits are really cheap and those scrappy little 12v air compressors are not much more than $10 these days when you find them on sale. Slow as hell but they get the job done.
 
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